Picking things back up

[webby2]

first,,
I cleaned the test-bed up and balanced it and used a better bearing setup and this condition stopped, it now is as would be expected where the larger mass changes much less than the smaller mass.

second,,
I now can accelerate a mass without influencing the arm it is sitting on very much, then I can decelerate that mass and have that influence the arm a lot, as in extracting back out of the mass all the energy I put into it to accelerate it,, minus frictional losses of course.

I am going to try a few changes to the existing test-bed to see if I can improve what it is doing and try and set it up so that it is completely autonomous.

[webby2]

Let me be a little clearer on this new thing.

I do not believe I can recover directly form the motor I am using as an input device to raise the potential of  the mass the amount of energy I put into the motor.

What I think my test-bed is showing is that throwing away some of the input energy is allowing me the possibility to extract work in a different method, or path, than the work used to raise the potential of the mass.

I am going to make a change that removes the loss mechanism, this should lead my test-bed then to extract some work while the mass is slowly accelerating up to the point where I can no longer accelerate the mass and the system will become a constant state.

Then I am going to change the amount of potential I throw away to try and find what would be the optimum relationship for my test-bed.

[webby2]

I was having some interesting results,, but I found the "hidden" influence that I was missing.

I use gravity often a a source of resistance and when you have two different rates of acceleration and don't think about it correctly what looks like a non reaction just might be that the rate of acceleration is so low that the small amount of gravity force being used is enough to stop things from changing,, then when the rate of acceleration is much higher you get a change.

What I was missing is the very simple basic fact that I was applying a small acceleration against the same mass for a longer time than the reverse amount of acceleration over a shorter time period,, f=ma so there was a much larger force for shorter time.

[webby2]

I think I have identified 2 fatal flaws with my test-bed and the changes I made to it.

I am going to address those flaws and see if the changes make a difference.

My mass distribution is way out of wack with what it is I am converting, as well as the current chosen method to do that conversion.

[webby2]

Breaking parts is part of the game,, I break a lot of things.

What is annoying to me is when I make the same mistake repeatably.  I try and keep clearances close but usually large enough to accommodate what I am doing,, but here I am having to re-do a bunch of parts because, like I have done many times before, I forgot to take into account the amount of shaft deflection there could be when that shaft is loaded,, so the 1mm of clearance I built to is not enough and things hit.

[webby2]

Some days when you keep making the same stupid observation and ignoring it, it is really silly after all, maybe you should go ahead and try and utilize it and see if there is anything there.

This is what I am doing now, well right now I am printing off a big part so when that is done I will start printing the parts to "test" my stupid observation.
If this works,, well then to make more out for the same RPM I would only need to build it bigger.

Simple concept is that the stronger force will overcome the weaker force leaving some force left over.

[webby2]

Things are very interesting.

 I am going back, way back in time as to how things were done, and then changing it up so i can use an electric motor as a load device/drive device for another system.

My view on torque is that it is a closed system, otherwise you have leverage and not torque.

[webby2]

This is my desk with a small sample of the test-bed parts I have made.

Within this small sample are some of the parts I used to "test" my concept of how to create and apply a torque. 
My solution is but one of many ways to go about it and now I am going to design a full system to run a real test.

[webby2]

I keep teasing myself with this build...
I printed off a few quick parts to make a slightly better finger toy version just to make a better decision on things,, Well that finger toy, being run by Mr. Hand, seems to show exactly what I thought and not what I was afraid would somehow be there.

Now to start with several very long prints,,,

[webby2]

funny thing,,,,,
As I am sitting here making the rest of the parts, I have the main "work horse" part built, a simple test came to mind to see if what I think I am doing is actually what I am getting and,, well,,, it is

This is the "work horse" part,, there are many parts inside it.

[webby2]

most days I am my biggest distraction and obstruction.

So I have been playing with the work horse and then for some reason I decided to change it and printed out another setup,,

It started out to just downsize the test-bed so that it could all be printed on an average 220mmX220mm printer, mine is larger at 310X310, but then while doing that, for some reason, I decided to add more complexity into the system and got all sidetracked with that instead of going back and running some very basic force measurements on the work horse.  I think I decided that what I think I have is in fact what I have without actually testing it all,, silly behavior on my part.

With all that, today I ran  few basic force tests on the work horse and,, well,, I did in fact get what I thought I would for the most part, but one reactionary force that I was planning on being 3/4 of the input\transfer force seems to be much lower and may be able to be almost canceled,, almost,, meaning most of my input could be converted into my output without a lot of reactionary forces interfering

[webby2]

still at it

I have destroyed a few of those yellow motors in testing some setups of what I am doing,, I showed one of the finger toys to my Son and he worked it and was puzzled over the "how" it could show him what it does.

Using all of this stuff to hopefully chase down that mysterious force of opposition, not the equal and opposite part,, is actually kind of fun

[webby2]

Feeling rather frustrated as of late.

You know how it goes, you build something and test it, make observations and then try and draw a few conclusions that you can then modify the test-bed for and see if what you think will happen does.

I have gone through a few mods using the workhorse setup and things keep going in the general direction that I am predicting they should, forces and directions working this way and that as I think they should.

Now I have taken all those observations and am trying to mod the test-bed to use them but unfortunately it might be that the amount of force I am throwing away, or that I need to throw away, is more than my little motors can handle.  I  am also failing at making some smooth guide pieces and so parts hang up on them,,

I am going to take a breather and think things over,, I might just have to design and print a completely new test-bed in order to incorporate the interactions I want to.

Lets just say that my little motors can make 10 N-cm of torque and I need to throw away half of that, so I am left with 5 N-cm of torque, now if the system is out 16cm from the pivot that will leave me with 0.3125N of force,, the reset device can use that up quickly.

The motors make more than that but I also need to throw away more than half,, well I should say that I am not using more than half rather than say throwing it away. 
Either way I am barley making enough with all of the roughness and bad design things going on

[webby2]

Well I have a workaround for printing stuff and have almost all my parts printed for my next test-bed,, this one has taken a while.

I am hopeful that it will show me more interesting things, even if it fails it should provide some knowledge and that is a good thing

[webby2]

interesting first run-up of the test-bed.

I have to order some small parts before I can really start running some tests but with what I have I have managed to cobble enough together to test the motions,, basically.

What I have so far is that when I take a load out of the system by a generator the reaction the system makes is in one direction, but when I use a mass the reaction is in the other direction, this is not what I was expecting.
The generator I am using is not so great and can not make much resistance at the rate I am running it, with that, the difference in reaction force between the generator and the mass is huge, the mass creates a much higher reactionary force, until of course it is up to the system speed.

Running the system with no output load does what I was hoping it would, which is nothing much of anything except the reset sub-system does create a load on the drive motor.

An interesting day